Is 'datus' used for a date in Latin?
In many languages the word for date (a specific day, such as January 2, 2019) seems to come from the Latin participle datus: we have the English "date", the Italian "data", the Swedish "datum", and others.
Do these words come from a Latin phrase such as dies datus/data?
If yes, when is it attested?
Latin origin seems evident, but I wonder whether it is classical or a later development.
etymologia time calendarium
add a comment |
In many languages the word for date (a specific day, such as January 2, 2019) seems to come from the Latin participle datus: we have the English "date", the Italian "data", the Swedish "datum", and others.
Do these words come from a Latin phrase such as dies datus/data?
If yes, when is it attested?
Latin origin seems evident, but I wonder whether it is classical or a later development.
etymologia time calendarium
2
FWIW, the dates of letters in Latin (at least contemporarily) use the participle: datae Romae, dies N... (or datus if it is a decree, for example)
– Rafael
9 hours ago
@Rafael Interesting! So the participle refers to the letter/decree/document, not the date itself? I read that as "given in Rome". I had imagined the participle would refer to dies in the Latin precursor to "date", but it doesn't have to be so.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
7 hours ago
I coudn't say, but I have always had that impression
– Rafael
6 hours ago
1
Interesting searches: datum Romae and data Romae maybe I was wrong about datae, specifically. There is also a number of occurrences of datis Romae
– Rafael
6 hours ago
add a comment |
In many languages the word for date (a specific day, such as January 2, 2019) seems to come from the Latin participle datus: we have the English "date", the Italian "data", the Swedish "datum", and others.
Do these words come from a Latin phrase such as dies datus/data?
If yes, when is it attested?
Latin origin seems evident, but I wonder whether it is classical or a later development.
etymologia time calendarium
In many languages the word for date (a specific day, such as January 2, 2019) seems to come from the Latin participle datus: we have the English "date", the Italian "data", the Swedish "datum", and others.
Do these words come from a Latin phrase such as dies datus/data?
If yes, when is it attested?
Latin origin seems evident, but I wonder whether it is classical or a later development.
etymologia time calendarium
etymologia time calendarium
asked 9 hours ago
Joonas Ilmavirta♦
45.7k1058262
45.7k1058262
2
FWIW, the dates of letters in Latin (at least contemporarily) use the participle: datae Romae, dies N... (or datus if it is a decree, for example)
– Rafael
9 hours ago
@Rafael Interesting! So the participle refers to the letter/decree/document, not the date itself? I read that as "given in Rome". I had imagined the participle would refer to dies in the Latin precursor to "date", but it doesn't have to be so.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
7 hours ago
I coudn't say, but I have always had that impression
– Rafael
6 hours ago
1
Interesting searches: datum Romae and data Romae maybe I was wrong about datae, specifically. There is also a number of occurrences of datis Romae
– Rafael
6 hours ago
add a comment |
2
FWIW, the dates of letters in Latin (at least contemporarily) use the participle: datae Romae, dies N... (or datus if it is a decree, for example)
– Rafael
9 hours ago
@Rafael Interesting! So the participle refers to the letter/decree/document, not the date itself? I read that as "given in Rome". I had imagined the participle would refer to dies in the Latin precursor to "date", but it doesn't have to be so.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
7 hours ago
I coudn't say, but I have always had that impression
– Rafael
6 hours ago
1
Interesting searches: datum Romae and data Romae maybe I was wrong about datae, specifically. There is also a number of occurrences of datis Romae
– Rafael
6 hours ago
2
2
FWIW, the dates of letters in Latin (at least contemporarily) use the participle: datae Romae, dies N... (or datus if it is a decree, for example)
– Rafael
9 hours ago
FWIW, the dates of letters in Latin (at least contemporarily) use the participle: datae Romae, dies N... (or datus if it is a decree, for example)
– Rafael
9 hours ago
@Rafael Interesting! So the participle refers to the letter/decree/document, not the date itself? I read that as "given in Rome". I had imagined the participle would refer to dies in the Latin precursor to "date", but it doesn't have to be so.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
7 hours ago
@Rafael Interesting! So the participle refers to the letter/decree/document, not the date itself? I read that as "given in Rome". I had imagined the participle would refer to dies in the Latin precursor to "date", but it doesn't have to be so.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
7 hours ago
I coudn't say, but I have always had that impression
– Rafael
6 hours ago
I coudn't say, but I have always had that impression
– Rafael
6 hours ago
1
1
Interesting searches: datum Romae and data Romae maybe I was wrong about datae, specifically. There is also a number of occurrences of datis Romae
– Rafael
6 hours ago
Interesting searches: datum Romae and data Romae maybe I was wrong about datae, specifically. There is also a number of occurrences of datis Romae
– Rafael
6 hours ago
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
For reference, this is what the OED has to say:
Etymology: < Anglo-Norman dat, Anglo-Norman and Middle French date
(Middle French datte ; French date ) regnal year (1230 or earlier),
date (specified on a document) (1281 in Old French), date (more
generally) (1314 or earlier) < post-classical Latin data (6th cent.;
frequently from 11th cent. in British sources), use as noun (see note)
of feminine singular of datus , past participle of dare to give (see
datum n.). In classical Latin, the date of a letter was expressed by a
phrase such as data xiiii K. Maias de Tarentino ‘(letter) sent from
Tarentum on 18th April’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus 3. 6. 1), litteras
datas a litoribus Britanniae proximis a. d. vi Kal. Octobr. ‘letter
sent from the nearest shores of Britain on 26th September’ (Cicero
Letters to Atticus 4. 18 . 5), litterarum datarum dies prid. Kal. Ian.
‘the day of a letter sent on 31st December’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus
6. 1. 2). Hence data , the first word of the formula, came to be used as a term for the time and place stated therein. Compare Catalan data
(14th cent.), Spanish †data (mid 13th cent.), Portuguese data (13th
cent.), Italian data (a1556). Compare also (after similar dating
formulae in post-classical Latin using the neuter singular datum (13th
cent.)) Middle Low German dātum , dāte , Middle Dutch, Dutch datum ,
Middle High German dātum (German Datum , in early modern German also
date ).
2
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
1 hour ago
1
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
53 mins ago
add a comment |
There seems no reason to doubt that the English 'date' and similar words in other languages derive from the perfect participle of dare.
A very plausible origin is as a a relic of litterae datae which was used to indicate the date on which a letter was handed over to a courier. This is also shown in the singular form [epistola] data quoted in the extract from the OED provided by @fdb.
add a comment |
Your Answer
StackExchange.ready(function() {
var channelOptions = {
tags: "".split(" "),
id: "644"
};
initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);
StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
// Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
createEditor();
});
}
else {
createEditor();
}
});
function createEditor() {
StackExchange.prepareEditor({
heartbeatType: 'answer',
autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
convertImagesToLinks: false,
noModals: true,
showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
reputationToPostImages: null,
bindNavPrevention: true,
postfix: "",
imageUploader: {
brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
allowUrls: true
},
noCode: true, onDemand: true,
discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
});
}
});
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2flatin.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f8810%2fis-datus-used-for-a-date-in-latin%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
For reference, this is what the OED has to say:
Etymology: < Anglo-Norman dat, Anglo-Norman and Middle French date
(Middle French datte ; French date ) regnal year (1230 or earlier),
date (specified on a document) (1281 in Old French), date (more
generally) (1314 or earlier) < post-classical Latin data (6th cent.;
frequently from 11th cent. in British sources), use as noun (see note)
of feminine singular of datus , past participle of dare to give (see
datum n.). In classical Latin, the date of a letter was expressed by a
phrase such as data xiiii K. Maias de Tarentino ‘(letter) sent from
Tarentum on 18th April’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus 3. 6. 1), litteras
datas a litoribus Britanniae proximis a. d. vi Kal. Octobr. ‘letter
sent from the nearest shores of Britain on 26th September’ (Cicero
Letters to Atticus 4. 18 . 5), litterarum datarum dies prid. Kal. Ian.
‘the day of a letter sent on 31st December’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus
6. 1. 2). Hence data , the first word of the formula, came to be used as a term for the time and place stated therein. Compare Catalan data
(14th cent.), Spanish †data (mid 13th cent.), Portuguese data (13th
cent.), Italian data (a1556). Compare also (after similar dating
formulae in post-classical Latin using the neuter singular datum (13th
cent.)) Middle Low German dātum , dāte , Middle Dutch, Dutch datum ,
Middle High German dātum (German Datum , in early modern German also
date ).
2
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
1 hour ago
1
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
53 mins ago
add a comment |
For reference, this is what the OED has to say:
Etymology: < Anglo-Norman dat, Anglo-Norman and Middle French date
(Middle French datte ; French date ) regnal year (1230 or earlier),
date (specified on a document) (1281 in Old French), date (more
generally) (1314 or earlier) < post-classical Latin data (6th cent.;
frequently from 11th cent. in British sources), use as noun (see note)
of feminine singular of datus , past participle of dare to give (see
datum n.). In classical Latin, the date of a letter was expressed by a
phrase such as data xiiii K. Maias de Tarentino ‘(letter) sent from
Tarentum on 18th April’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus 3. 6. 1), litteras
datas a litoribus Britanniae proximis a. d. vi Kal. Octobr. ‘letter
sent from the nearest shores of Britain on 26th September’ (Cicero
Letters to Atticus 4. 18 . 5), litterarum datarum dies prid. Kal. Ian.
‘the day of a letter sent on 31st December’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus
6. 1. 2). Hence data , the first word of the formula, came to be used as a term for the time and place stated therein. Compare Catalan data
(14th cent.), Spanish †data (mid 13th cent.), Portuguese data (13th
cent.), Italian data (a1556). Compare also (after similar dating
formulae in post-classical Latin using the neuter singular datum (13th
cent.)) Middle Low German dātum , dāte , Middle Dutch, Dutch datum ,
Middle High German dātum (German Datum , in early modern German also
date ).
2
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
1 hour ago
1
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
53 mins ago
add a comment |
For reference, this is what the OED has to say:
Etymology: < Anglo-Norman dat, Anglo-Norman and Middle French date
(Middle French datte ; French date ) regnal year (1230 or earlier),
date (specified on a document) (1281 in Old French), date (more
generally) (1314 or earlier) < post-classical Latin data (6th cent.;
frequently from 11th cent. in British sources), use as noun (see note)
of feminine singular of datus , past participle of dare to give (see
datum n.). In classical Latin, the date of a letter was expressed by a
phrase such as data xiiii K. Maias de Tarentino ‘(letter) sent from
Tarentum on 18th April’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus 3. 6. 1), litteras
datas a litoribus Britanniae proximis a. d. vi Kal. Octobr. ‘letter
sent from the nearest shores of Britain on 26th September’ (Cicero
Letters to Atticus 4. 18 . 5), litterarum datarum dies prid. Kal. Ian.
‘the day of a letter sent on 31st December’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus
6. 1. 2). Hence data , the first word of the formula, came to be used as a term for the time and place stated therein. Compare Catalan data
(14th cent.), Spanish †data (mid 13th cent.), Portuguese data (13th
cent.), Italian data (a1556). Compare also (after similar dating
formulae in post-classical Latin using the neuter singular datum (13th
cent.)) Middle Low German dātum , dāte , Middle Dutch, Dutch datum ,
Middle High German dātum (German Datum , in early modern German also
date ).
For reference, this is what the OED has to say:
Etymology: < Anglo-Norman dat, Anglo-Norman and Middle French date
(Middle French datte ; French date ) regnal year (1230 or earlier),
date (specified on a document) (1281 in Old French), date (more
generally) (1314 or earlier) < post-classical Latin data (6th cent.;
frequently from 11th cent. in British sources), use as noun (see note)
of feminine singular of datus , past participle of dare to give (see
datum n.). In classical Latin, the date of a letter was expressed by a
phrase such as data xiiii K. Maias de Tarentino ‘(letter) sent from
Tarentum on 18th April’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus 3. 6. 1), litteras
datas a litoribus Britanniae proximis a. d. vi Kal. Octobr. ‘letter
sent from the nearest shores of Britain on 26th September’ (Cicero
Letters to Atticus 4. 18 . 5), litterarum datarum dies prid. Kal. Ian.
‘the day of a letter sent on 31st December’ (Cicero Letters to Atticus
6. 1. 2). Hence data , the first word of the formula, came to be used as a term for the time and place stated therein. Compare Catalan data
(14th cent.), Spanish †data (mid 13th cent.), Portuguese data (13th
cent.), Italian data (a1556). Compare also (after similar dating
formulae in post-classical Latin using the neuter singular datum (13th
cent.)) Middle Low German dātum , dāte , Middle Dutch, Dutch datum ,
Middle High German dātum (German Datum , in early modern German also
date ).
answered 4 hours ago
fdb
10.5k11127
10.5k11127
2
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
1 hour ago
1
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
53 mins ago
add a comment |
2
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
1 hour ago
1
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
53 mins ago
2
2
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
1 hour ago
Could datum at the start of a letter mean "dictated"? I ask because I've seen Da as a command from teacher to student to recite something, and I'm thinking that the Cicero class would typically dictate a letter to a slave/secretary rather than put pen to papyrus themselves.
– Ben Kovitz
1 hour ago
1
1
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
53 mins ago
@BenKovitz I would much like to see that as a separate question. Too interesting to be buried in comments here, I think.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
53 mins ago
add a comment |
There seems no reason to doubt that the English 'date' and similar words in other languages derive from the perfect participle of dare.
A very plausible origin is as a a relic of litterae datae which was used to indicate the date on which a letter was handed over to a courier. This is also shown in the singular form [epistola] data quoted in the extract from the OED provided by @fdb.
add a comment |
There seems no reason to doubt that the English 'date' and similar words in other languages derive from the perfect participle of dare.
A very plausible origin is as a a relic of litterae datae which was used to indicate the date on which a letter was handed over to a courier. This is also shown in the singular form [epistola] data quoted in the extract from the OED provided by @fdb.
add a comment |
There seems no reason to doubt that the English 'date' and similar words in other languages derive from the perfect participle of dare.
A very plausible origin is as a a relic of litterae datae which was used to indicate the date on which a letter was handed over to a courier. This is also shown in the singular form [epistola] data quoted in the extract from the OED provided by @fdb.
There seems no reason to doubt that the English 'date' and similar words in other languages derive from the perfect participle of dare.
A very plausible origin is as a a relic of litterae datae which was used to indicate the date on which a letter was handed over to a courier. This is also shown in the singular form [epistola] data quoted in the extract from the OED provided by @fdb.
answered 25 mins ago
Tom Cotton
13.8k11144
13.8k11144
add a comment |
add a comment |
Thanks for contributing an answer to Latin Language Stack Exchange!
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Some of your past answers have not been well-received, and you're in danger of being blocked from answering.
Please pay close attention to the following guidance:
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2flatin.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f8810%2fis-datus-used-for-a-date-in-latin%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
2
FWIW, the dates of letters in Latin (at least contemporarily) use the participle: datae Romae, dies N... (or datus if it is a decree, for example)
– Rafael
9 hours ago
@Rafael Interesting! So the participle refers to the letter/decree/document, not the date itself? I read that as "given in Rome". I had imagined the participle would refer to dies in the Latin precursor to "date", but it doesn't have to be so.
– Joonas Ilmavirta♦
7 hours ago
I coudn't say, but I have always had that impression
– Rafael
6 hours ago
1
Interesting searches: datum Romae and data Romae maybe I was wrong about datae, specifically. There is also a number of occurrences of datis Romae
– Rafael
6 hours ago